Hatred Of Magic

@azul88 - yes we are connected to the universe and we can harness its energy but that doesn't mean that we can control the laws..

take this as an example, you are an engineering student and you are much connected to it because you are so genius and you really like the course but as you can see, even if you are so genius and very much connected to all of the subjects you can't control what was established.. you can create your own law but if you are going to consider this, you have to derive it from the original one.. (and you have to understand that creating is much differ from controlling what was existed)

same goes in magick..

darkest blessings..

Brysing and AwakeTooLong, i agree with both of you, there's no major harm in people believing what they want [to an extent] but the whole childish refuse to accept they may but incorrect, but stomping their foot and demanding they're right and the one pointing it out is the misguided one really gets annoying.

look, most people [the 'masters' as you called them, yet i have yet to meet someone who knows what they're doing and call them self a master] start out wanting to help, they see someone believing that if they just believe hard enough they can do something [let's say fly] but they cannot do in the physical realm. so they very kindly say 'actually RandomUserName, you cannot do that for magic works to take energy and change it to help us, but it cannot change things that cannot physically happen, understand?'

from here, two things happen, the person gets sad and thinks twice about spells they find [which is what the 'master' intended] or they get something like 'what gives you the right to say i'm wrong? it's magick and magick works however i want it to! you think you're so great, well all i see is a close minded person who knows nothing!'

as time goes on the once kind person grows bitter and annoyed, eventually most start thinking there's no reasoning with fluffies and start cutting them down.

i know this is winded, but i've know many nice people who this has happened to. while the ability to fly, teleport, become a mythical creature would be the bee's knees [sorry, felt like saying that] it's not possible because while magic can do many things, it cannot change physical limitations, it just does not work that way, it's the same as training a cat to bark by giving it treats, [and no surgery involved] it cannot happen while some may argue it can, it's so improvable that the odds of it happening are none. it doesn't hurt anyone to believe it, no, until your words make others believe and before you know it, people are running around saying their cat barks, but only when she feels like it or something.

Ok guys I see what your saying I really do. And for 20 years of my life I believe what you do. I am 23. That science is the only way and I still have a logical point of view. I just have an open mind now. I know that this isn't proof that your looking for but my chi flows really easy. For chi masters they take they entire lives to get that strong but for me I have come a long way in just a year. I can make shapes with it and knock stuff over. Like balls and shields. It protects me from the cold. Plus their is my elemental spells. My elemental spells are 20% stronger than my normal spells. I can call forth the elements (their energies) really easy and feel their power easy. I can sense all energy. And yeah I know that last one sounds weird. But there isn't an energy that I have come across that I can't sense and feel with my mind. I can do all of these things simply because I believe they are possible. Again I am not looking to convert anyone and this is hardly proof but take it or leave it. My beliefs are my own. I was only curious about other peoples view points on the subject.

Sensing energy sounds far less weird than claims of being able to knock over things with balls of chi. All that you describe makes sense, except I'm sure you're applying it to the physical nature of the elements rather than the more esoteric qualities.

Neko, there is everything wrong in allowing delusion to flourish. However, you can only try to tell somebody something so much before it becomes obvious that it is pointless.

i see the harm in people believing they can fly by chanting a few words and jumping from a tree, but if it's chant a few words and become a vampire, while i'll argue it, it's no skin off my nose if they call me close minded.

There is no truth, there is not lie, there is no right or wrong. It's all just a belief. Everyone is right about what they think. for some witchcraft isn't real because to them they aren't real. Life has many facets, we each have our own one.

~ A wise man, recognizing that the world is but an illusion, does not act as if it is real, so he escapes the suffering. ~ Buddha

The minute we begin debating "reality" and "truth" is the very minute a topic becomes rubbish (sounds better than garbage). Reality is an illusion because our reality is our perception and who is to say that humans can perceive the world correctly? Dogs see in black and white, and to them the world is grey and consists of their personal territory and pack. Our reality is only as far as our comprehension of the world.

HOWEVER, we also cannot say "anything" is possible because anything is a very broad term. Saying "anything" in itself sounds ridiculous. If anything was possible we would have no such thing as "order" and nearly every culture agrees that before order was chaos. For "anything" to be possible we would need to go back to chaos. We all have set limitations. Birds don't fly high enough to reach space because the thin air will kill them before they reach that point. It is a limit. The ocean doesn't float. Its limitation is in gravity. I do believe that there is NO limit to what magick itself can do, however there is a physical limit to what a human being can do with magick. (Just as we also have a limit to our comprehension and perception of reality.) There is a reason why miracles are viewed as higher beings stepping in. When someone makes the "impossible" happen they never seem to be able to make it reoccur!

Is a human capable of amazing things? Most certainly! But there are natural laws that regulate our limits. Can we find holes in those limitations? Possibly. But that is why magick is considered a science. Sheer hope alone doesn't turn iron into gold. One must understand it inside and out, not just through books (especially the new age garbage) but through observation, investigation and experimentation. In short, a lot of work, dedication, intellect, and luck.

I agree with you Raven on all accounts except one: I don't view magic as a science but that is my belief. Humans are powerful but somewhere along the way we lost sight of that.

Magick is natural, but what I was trying to say is that when you poke at the barrier of magick within human limitation, it must be approached with a scientific mind and method. Just hoping and believing won't find holes in the possible/impossible.

Just as people 100 years ago would never have believed people could fly in a machine, "impossible" is only what has yet to be figured out. But it doesn't mean it is an easy task, and most people fail.

The reason why "impossible" is thrown around here isn't because anyone is closed minded, it is because they are sensible enough to know that the average person will never attempt to go through years of study and dedication just to MAYBE find a way to accomplish something they're hoping to, with no guaranty. They are still in the beginning stages of learning magick and want to do things that few to none have ever accomplished. It is better to say it is "impossible" than to let them become discouraged with magick altogether because they are attempting to do things beyond natural human limitation. And some things are just plainly pointless and demonstrates that their reasons for approaching magick are not the right ones. If they want to impress their friends with tricks, that's what stage magic is for. So many here say this and that is impossible because it is an unwise goal and not the true beauty of magick.

The reference I made to alchemy (iron into gold) hinted to this. Alchemists did not seek to turn iron into gold to become rich or to be cool. Alchemists were scientists who dedicated themselves to seeking out a way to connect with the Source. Their philosophy was that everything came from the same energy source, therefore everything has the same energy at its foundation. If someone were capable of turning iron (the dirtiest metal) into gold (the purest metal) that would mean they had found the philosopher's stone. Perfection! Enlightenment! They would be one with the universe. You see, it wasn't about iron into gold after all. THAT is a beautiful goal and one that (as Awake already pointed out) many people seek.

Its the same with walking over fire, levitation attempts, etc The idea is, IF they can achieve such feats, they have reached a higher state of being aka enlightenment. It isn't about tricks, its about what's inside us and the nature/universe around us.

One of the reasons I don't sign-on frequently is because there is so much advice on this site that tends to discourage practitioners and disqualify various types of magicks. I am amazed that so many people think of themselves as "practitioners of magick/magic" but turn around and state on these posts that anything other than a mundane outcome through “hard work” is impossible.

Magick is not reason or logic. Reason and logic are generally mathematical expressions used in an attempt to finitely define the world around us. The natural “laws” were defined by humans who are still attempting to understand the natural world. Anyone who studies physics will tell you that it’s not an absolute science and that for every law there is a condition that breaks that law or rather there is an exception to the law. The closest science has come to any form of “accurate” description is through quantum mechanics. Quantum physics basically describes magick through a series of laws that have mutable traits. God and Energy have the same description: Was, is and always will be. Can neither be created nor destroyed and continuously Moves into through and out of form. Whether there is a spiritual or scientific description, it is the same description. We are made up of that which is described as energy.

It's not about having an open or closed mind, it's about awareness. That awareness is not belief or understanding, but rather knowing in and at that moment of manifestation. To put it into other words magick happens when our minds ( wants & desires), spirit (identity), energy (being) has come into balance with what we know as the “physical world” When one successfully casts a spell or working, you just “know” it was successful because you can feel it. A lot of truly gifted people have had the benefit of experiencing that awareness in the form of magical outcomes, but they would be hard pressed to explain how to duplicate the same results to another person. They may not even be able to repeat on command what they manifested in a moment of need and desire. I imagine that this site exists for people to help each other navigate the mystical and magickal world.

I have repeatedly performed magick that others on this site say is impossible but I have done so and continue to do so to this day. People design rituals to make that awareness present and part of their consciousness and subconscious. I can tell you it is not the magick performed in routine rituals that I have obtained what I focused on. It was the magick performed in the moment with the knowing and awareness that I manifested. The rituals set the conditions for a magickal outcome in my mind, I come to this site to learn of others ideas, techniques and hear of the awareness of others. I know that everyone on this site has some form of that awareness or they wouldn’t bother practicing magick.