No proof - not real

Hi there im a big fan of this sort of thing, iv always liked tv shows on this subject such as charmed and especially supernatural, but iv realised that on these sort of sites who seem to claim that its real and you can see results is that its jus a bunch of people who havent got a life who tries to chant these spells an believe them to work.

theres actually people who says iv made it work but if that were true the world would be a much more different place, if we were capable of things like that.

anyone ever hear the story of the king who loved new outfits, more an more expensive each time? 2 men came to him saying they have new magical fabrics who only clever and smart people can see and idiots and morons wont see a thing. when they were done with the outfit the king saw nothing and thought not to make it obvious that his an idiot so acted like he had something on which he could see and ended up going infront of his people naked and everybody acted like he had a great new outfit on not to be an idiot..

the moral of this story is i think on these sites people pretend they work and keep trying hoping it will not to seem "powerless".

my actual post of this thread is to show you al something, something that will make u jumping for joy if you really do cast spells successfully.

and thats the challenge on randi.org they are helping people prove their abilities, just to prove it exists for 1 million..

funny thing is i can bet my life on the fact that everybody on these sort of sites will be nothing but a joke to a real life challenge.. its called proof which no one can display..

but hey who knows there could be real black magic books centurys old which do work.. but you wont find anything good through the internet, so dont read through these sites and hope to be able to perform a miracle from your pc chair.

i dont mean to offend or spam. its just the truth i hope we have a nice discussion about this, and i hope someone doesnt just come along and delete this thread because that would leave no doubts that you are all fooling yourselves and hiding the truth.

Real magic is nothing like the way TV shows show it; at least in my experience. When it comes down to it your reality is based on belief, or faith as some people call it. How do you know that you really exist? "I think therefore I am," is one speculation. But you really don't know. Perhaps someone is messing with us like what happened so often in Star Trek and Hitch Hiker's Guide. What we see is not what we get. It is a mere glimpse of reality.

You believe in the wind, but you cannot see it. You only believe because you see the effects of the wind. Magic is so much more than mere tricks. I certainly have no desire to prove anything to anybody. In this life you don't have to prove anything to anybody but yourself. Do I know for sure that what I believe it true? no. But I believe it and that creates my reality, just as any other religion. I'm not going to spend my life going around trying to convince others to follow my way of life and "convert" them. I learned a long time ago that is annoying and rude. Plus, you can't teach anyone who doesn't have any belief to begin with. There is no point. I would love it if everyone agreed with me and did things my way, but what kind of life would that be? It would be so boring if everyone was the same. Individuality would be gone.

I'm not sure what you are trying to accomplish with your post. Are you trying to convince us we are crazy? Or are you trying to learn magic? Or are you just stopping by to vent? I don't see much point in it. People are always going to believe what they want to no matter what they are told.

when i think deep down about it, its more about my common sense fighting with my hope to have certain abilities.. not even abilities but to accomplish something supernatural, i would die a happy man if i could read a spell off this site and make even a ripple in a puddle.. or move a matchbox just a bit. or anything to prove that all of this has even a tiny bit of truth.

maybe because im just angry.. i wish i could do something anything and the fact that i cant and know that its not possible together with the fact that these sites say you can kinda jus pisses me off.

Just try focusing on being a good person and living a good life. Don't focus on what you can't do and more on what you can do. Everyone has abilities, even if they aren't Magical. Whether you are good with computers, teaching, writing or acting they are still important. You don't need to believe what we believe to have a good life. You can still change the world. Perhaps someday you will figure out what your truth is. It's not something that you figure out overnight. I have a pretty good idea of what I believe, but I am still searching. I don't think we ever stop.

Many that end up working with 'magick' or spiritual things. Are going in simulare ways as 'the way of the warior' or 'spiritual worior'
where the goal is to evolve and overcome you're fear.
And/or to get in contackt with somthing 'highter' then one self. (or a 'highter' self. And so on)

some use rituals or spells as tools to focus theyr will.

Also in the 'magickal' part. There is the 'changing' tings around you.
(if you then use a spell. And putt all your energys into that)
let's say you are feeling shy or unsure in a case or so on. And you use a spell to change this. Are it's then somthing 'magick' or you that change it.
If you truly belive that the spell works. You wil be more determed. And confident.
And others pick that up from you. (that thing is another discusion topic itself)
so is it magick, or just a self 'changing' thing. (like psycoligy)
I realy don't care. I'm do have knowlege about both parts. But I don't care about if it's on or another.
It is that it work that mathers.

Do 'magick'' work? Yes. But what is magick to you..,
Is it 'firebals from the hands' well. Then I supose you have a very loong way to go...
Or is it somthing you wish for that come trou.
Well. I go for the last of those.
(and then some. )

Myrdin

It's amusing how people often think they need a light show just to believe in something.

The proof is there; but people tend to see only what they want to.

You want to be the smart one- the clever one ahead of the game- to see through illusions and show people how easy it is to see clearly in the world.
Reality check: magic, is simply put- the working of the Universe's energies. There you have it, energy causing things to take certain forms and positions in the world.

That my friend, is true magic.
Not setting a firecracker behind your back with smoke machines hidden in the bushes, then saying ''I'm making it rain, can't you hear the thunder?''

What we learn here is how to manipulate that energy surrounding us.

You may say we're wasting our time, but we're at least living life by growing happier and wiser (I've matured more when studying magic and such things than most people my age); while might I add, you waste your time with threads like this one attempting to convince and entire website to your mere opinions.

I bid you good luck and may you have a good time,
Lady_Snow

I like this post because it brings up a good point. I've seen a lot of people go hey look I practice magic and they try to do something to impress their friends and end up making a fool of themselves. However I think through practicing I have matured more than I would have otherwise. I used to have problems with anger management but because I practiced that went away, not because of some spell or enchantment but because I learned how to concentrate better and to have more self control so yes I believe a lot of magic is fake or psychological probably most but when you see something real you will know it. However even if you aren't successful in what your doing it can still help you in other ways like how it helped me.

I submit this in response to the Randi challenge:

http://www.angelfire.com/mi3/tomekeeper/jref.html

and also offer up this site for consideration:

http://www.angelfire.com/mi3/tomekeeper/index.html


I greatly respect Tomekeepers works, and he makes many valid points on the nature of magic and energy work.

the only thing I have against this is that you point out about physical abilities, where spell casting can be done by anyone so long as they have the proper training, and the right mind set as well as a basic understanding of how energy works. A SPELL works like this Energy + (the + is for influence) Energy = Change, there is your scientific formula for spell work. It's your energy influencing the energy around you to create a change that is needed, such as bringing the proper opportunity, this goes deeper into the law of attraction as well that I won't get into here, but that you can research yourself.

Although I may applaud Rani for his works, I don't think it's right to offer up a challenge for someone to prove themselves, and then when they make a fool of themselves claim something isn't real. Someone with a true talent isn't going to use it to benefit themselves, because they have the basic understanding that anything done in self gain will backfire.

For example, I'm a tarot reader, but I only ask for donations because I refuse to charge people for knowledge. The donations help keep a site that I run online. People will donate as they see fit, but others (in the case of Sylvia Brown who exploit people) who try to exploit and do things for self gain will literally end up hurting themselves.

I fully believe that when something is done out of selflessness then it's more likely to be beneficial to the whole, than it is to act out of selfishness and ruin it for everyone.

You can say that some of us are fakes or frauds, doesn't bother me none the least. I'm not going to exploit myself here either. I've been a practitioner of magic for a little over 11 years and have had the most wonderful of experiences. Although a good chunk of what I do is centered on belief, I also know that magic doesn't work instantaneously and takes time for things to take effect and being working. Energy can only move so fast and is still limited not only by the laws of nature, but by the practitioner doing it as well.

Anyways, I think I'll step off my soap box here, but one last thing. You are entitled to your opinion and your right to speak freely, but those of us who have our lives set in this way, are no different then you. We DO have lives that we live outside of this site and outside of magic. The only difference is that we embrace it, where as others may not do so without a fight to their own ego's.

Just because you don't believe something doesn't mean that others don't. A wise man I used to know once said "Seeing is not believing. Believing is seeing." He meant that you shouldn't have to see something to believe it. When you DO believe in something you are more likely to see it.

You can call us frauds all you want but those of us who do believe don't give a flying flip about if you believe we can do it or not. We know we can and that's all that matters to us.